Link to ExpressJet TA

ASApuppy

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ACARS is a simple system. Out time = pax door closed, parking brake released, off time = weight off wheels, on time = weight on wheels, in time = pax door open. That is it! No other way to monitor. The anti-skid system is not linked into the ACARS system so there is no way for the company to monitor wheel speed!
You are completely wrong about this. On an airplane like the CRJ there exists a thing called the ARINC databus. Think of it as the airplanes own, individual internet that exists for different computers to talk to one another. Everything is on this data bus. ACARS, right now, is programmed to set out times when doors closed and brake off. It could be reprogrammed to anything. It could be the beacon, cargo door, or wheel speed greater than zero.

You should also know that since we got ACARS that the company monitors your flight data. They know most things that go to the flight data recorder every 3 minutes or so when the ACARS sends down a snap shot of the flight. Every see those "VHF in Progress" when you didn't ask for anything? King Tutt knows if you fly cost index or not. Hit APR on a 700/900 and 50 Blackberries light up.
 

COOPERVANE

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They know most things that go to the flight data recorder every 3 minutes or so when the ACARS sends down a snap shot of the flight. Every see those "VHF in Progress" when you didn't ask for anything? King Tutt knows if you fly cost index or not. Hit APR on a 700/900 and 50 Blackberries light up.

I was told that the way they discovered the BTR incident was somebody's blackberry at Bombardier lit up reporting that a CRJ went to 126% N1. They called ASA maint in ATL and asked what the hell was going on. ATL then called BTR.

Evidently nobody thought N1 would EVER hit that
 

Mickey Mouse

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They already have, or can easily obtain available transponder technology that shows your exact position on the field. That's why we leave the transponder on for ATL ramps, as well other ATC requested airports for movement areas. The new checklist will have all crews leave the transponder on at all airports after landing. More than one person working on the new checklist has explained this to me.
 

Clutch

Hi, I'm William Devane
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Why the hell would the company want to change the way we record our times? Don't they want on time performance? Wake up fools.
 

COOPERVANE

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Why the hell would the company want to change the way we record our times? Don't they want on time performance? Wake up fools.
DOT performance based on door close. Pay determined by aircraft movement. As long as its agreed upon in a JCBA they could index pay to OFF times if they wanted to. Someday they'll probably wantthis.

It doesnt HAVE to be the same, it just traditionally HAS been. Dangerous precedent eh?
 

Clutch

Hi, I'm William Devane
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DOT performance based on door close. Pay determined by aircraft movement. As long as its agreed upon in a JCBA they could index pay to OFF times if they wanted to. Someday they'll probably wantthis.

It doesnt HAVE to be the same, it just traditionally HAS been. Dangerous precedent eh?
If that were the case, would you ever shut the door on time if the ground crew wasn't ready? Would anybody? That's a dangerous game and you're reading too much into that provision
 

Nevets

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If that were the case, would you ever shut the door on time if the ground crew wasn't ready? Would anybody? That's a dangerous game and you're reading too much into that provision

If this isn't something management doesn't want to reserve the right to do in the future, then why did they differentiate between the fleets?
 

wms

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I had a grievance for not getting paid when we were at the gate with the door closed for two hours and then had to open it. They said the wheels never turned so we lost the pay. That was two years ago, they can already see wheel motion on the CRJ and currently track it.
 

Clutch

Hi, I'm William Devane
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So in your opinion, Bill, is it something we should really harp on considering it is the current way of doing things?
 

wms

billSquared
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It might be in the books now, but when I compare pairings, out/in, rainmaker and my pay it's all based on brakes. That's the language I want. As far as harping, there is nothing on the TA that earns a yes vote. I'm not gonna focus on one issue, it's almost all bad.

When we went into negotiations my vote was no. ALPAs job was to earn a yes, they failed.

As far as supply/demand and fear of shrinking, that's not what I care about.

I believe CT when he says there is no plan to wind us down, and I believe no matter how the vote goes that won't change. I also believe Sgu is smart enough to get work regardless of their overhead. And we all know no matter how this vote goes this and every regional will shrink.

I can't control the industry or mgmt, I only have a say in this TA with my vote. NO
 
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wms

billSquared
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PS. That was two hours of work, caring for pax, coordinating deicing and negotiating with ATC that ended up being for free. It's just a little taste of what life would be like under this TA.
 

Clutch

Hi, I'm William Devane
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It might be in the books now, but when I compare pairings, out/in, rainmaker and my pay it's all based on brakes. That's the language I want. As far as harping, there is nothing on the TA that earns a yes vote. I'm not gonna focus on one issue, it's almost all bad.

When we went into negotiations my vote was no. ALPAs job was to earn a yes, they failed.

As far as supply/demand and fear of shrinking, that's not what I care about.

I believe CT when he says there is no plan to wind us down, and I believe no matter how the vote goes that won't change. I also believe Sgu is smart enough to get work regardless of their overhead. And we all know no matter how this vote goes this and every regional will shrink.

I can't control the industry or mgmt, I only have a say in this TA with my vote. NO
My point is we have a lot of issues to address with this TA, is this really a priority or can we just consider it status quo and move on. A big problem is that a lot of people didn't know their current contract and are pissed off to see the same provisions in the proposed TA. If it ain't
broke don't fix it. Is it broke or not? Because the way I see it, the block in and out issue is a NON issue.

We have to make a list of things we want changed in the new TA. Is this really one of them?
 
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Ops check good

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what?
You are completely wrong about this. On an airplane like the CRJ there exists a thing called the ARINC databus. Think of it as the airplanes own, individual internet that exists for different computers to talk to one another. Everything is on this data bus. ACARS, right now, is programmed to set out times when doors closed and brake off. It could be reprogrammed to anything. It could be the beacon, cargo door, or wheel speed greater than zero.

You should also know that since we got ACARS that the company monitors your flight data. They know most things that go to the flight data recorder every 3 minutes or so when the ACARS sends down a snap shot of the flight. Every see those "VHF in Progress" when you didn't ask for anything? King Tutt knows if you fly cost index or not. Hit APR on a 700/900 and 50 Blackberries light up.
You know, in all these years as an A&P mechanic I never knew that airplanes had an AIRINC data bus? I'm excited to go to work and tell all of my co workers what a pilot taught me about airplanes!
 
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701EV

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a lot

Mickey Mouse

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How the fck did the JNBC think that Captains flying as FOs was a good idea? We got rid of that stupid practice in the last contract for a variety of good reasons. I know you guys are trying to keep cool heads during this TA process, but every section I read infuriates me. I'm trying to stay business minded, but quite frankly this TA is offensive on a personal level.
 

Nevets

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My point is we have a lot of issues to address with this TA, is this really a priority or can we just consider it status quo and move on. A big problem is that a lot of people didn't know their current contract and are pissed off to see the same provisions in the proposed TA. If it ain't

broke don't fix it. Is it broke or not? Because the way I see it, the block in and out issue is a NON issue.



We have to make a list of things we want changed in the new TA. Is this really one of them?

That's like having your head in a guillotine and saying that it's not broken because it hasn't been released.
 
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waterskier

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We should get paid by duty time... It would be a lower hourly rate of course... The entire time I am at the airport in uniform, I represent the company, and have to follow procedures, and am responsible for my actions and decisions, so why am I not being paid for this time. This is a major problem with our compensation process. It sure would simplify things.... Kinda like the income tax system... complex system that get more complex every year, to benefit everyone else but me.... Consumption based tax!!!
 
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