UPS Airbus down in Birmingham

[livin'thesim]

Hard to see how the cargo carriers are going to be able to resist implementation of 117 now.

I would hate to be one of those "UPS officials" who are trying to sell the idea that this crew wasn't tired, with the crew essentially telling people that their schedules were fatiguing them.

 

[frank rizzo]

I hope the pilot group gives them hell and demand the same duty rest times as passenger ops The chair person of the NTSB Hersman is not qualified to talk or run the agency her only previous experience was child safety seat certifications at the highway transportation dept. she has put everything back fifty years WTF !!

 

[Golden Falcon]

PF looking outside as he should on a LOC APP!!
I though that happens after PNF says at least "APP LIGHTS inside" or one of does required calls, or did I mis when the PNF says it?

Unfamiliar with UPS SOP's...All I know was there was a comment by the Capt...who was PF, "runway in sight"...One would assume (hope) the other pilot would be "inside" monitoring minimums, sink rate speed etc....etc...doesn't appear to be the case...a study in CFIT accidents while on approach showed the majority were on track, but for some reason or the other, blew the vertical profile and crashed short....as is the case here..last callout regarding altitude on the transcript was at 1000'....if this was from the baro altimeter, that would be approximately 200' above minimums...don't see any reference to any specific call "minimums"...which they passed through at VS-1500...(unstable by any standard)...

 

[livin'thesim]

passed through at VS-1500...(unstable by any standard)...

It's within criteria if briefed at a lot of carriers. VS1000 is a default standard with a lot of operators, but no reason not to use 1500 if there is a legitimate reason, such as a steep gradient in the final segment.

 

[DCAA320]

It's within criteria if briefed at a lot of carriers.

-1500 VS inside FAF

Been flying 30 years, hell no. Never heard it briefed before and just fu{king stupid.

 

[ackattacker]

It's within criteria if briefed at a lot of carriers. VS1000 is a default standard with a lot of operators, but no reason not to use 1500 if there is a legitimate reason, such as a steep gradient in the final segment.

Read Advisory Circular 120-71A and get back to us.

3.2 degree glidepath and 140kts approximate groundspeed for this approach results in 792 FPM.

 

[Caddaddy]

Whatever happened to the basic 3 to 1? It's the most basic tool available to any approach! Just type in the runway into the fix page or prog or whatever it's called in your airplane and put it in the scan. I'm working 3 to 1 from top of descent all the way to touchdown. In 33 years of flying it hasn't failed me yet! I do see many of my fellow aviators not have a clue when they're cleared all the way from TOD down to the final approach altitude. The magic's great and we still have to fly and show up well rested. It's personal responsibility!

 

[DCAA320]

Whatever happened to the basic 3 to 1? It's the most basic tool available to any approach! Just type in the runway into the fix page or prog or whatever it's called in your airplane and put it in the scan. I'm working 3 to 1 from top of descent all the way to touchdown. In 33 years of flying it hasn't failed me yet! I do see many of my fellow aviators not have a clue when they're cleared all the way from TOD down to the final approach altitude. The magic's great and we still have to fly and show up well rested. It's personal responsibility!

If there are obstacles, you cannot use that.

99.99% of the time you are right, I use it too.

 

[livin'thesim]

Okay, all-knowing, all-seeing Lord of the Sky.

Perhaps you've just not been exposed to one of the (relatively) rare situations where greater than VS-1000 is required.

Obviously, Birmingham was not one of those situations.

 

[DCAA320]

Okay, all-knowing, all-seeing Lord of the Sky.

Perhaps you've just not been exposed to one of the (relatively) rare situations where greater than VS-1000 is required.

Obviously, Birmingham was not one of those situations.

OK, good luck to you guys, wish u well.

-1500 VS that close is just strange.