Netjets Casino employees

[Diesel]

Then how do you explain one of the line pilots on the Boeing being the lead negotiator for our contract.

You might want to inform him that he's not working for 1108 i'm sure he'll be shocked.

 

[x402]

It's ironic that the non-union pilots were able to negotiate better compensation, workrules and basing than you could and now you want to force them into your union to share your good deal.

In some ways the Gulfstream guys at NJI are benefiting from pay by weight, but mainly it's just that accross the industry Gulfstream pilots are paid well.

It's interesting that the NJA Boeing pilots have formed their own company with a separate pay scale starting at $135K and make up to $213K for flying a larger aircraft, but you guys never mention that. Really, ask yourselves why is there a split here?

NJI's pilots are poorly paid in the GWizz world, they don't negotiate for anything. They get what Santulli wants to give them.

Even our old limp d**ked MEC managed to get a pretty good deal for our senior guys in the BBJ. NJA operates the BBJ's, in twenty years I'll be able to hold one. A little fact checking next time before you make a fool of yourself.

 

[FAcFriend]

You ask why one of our MEC would not sign a non-disclosure form. This union has said they always will keep the lines of comunication truthful and OPEN. The fact that this man would not sign it, even though it would make him look bad to some people, should show you the resolve and INTEGRITY of this man.

First I think it is great that you are starting a real dialogue here with the other employees- you are giving everyone a chance to better understand- so lets keep the cutting comments out of this post...

I mean no argument here- just looking at it differently-
Didn't you elect this man to represent you in these talks. You pay him to go learn all he can about the process, company etc. and then work on your behalf. Isnt this a bit like Bush saying "dont tell me all about Korea? I want to be transparent to the American people?"

I dont want to buy the company line- I want to understand your perspective as well. But just telling me that the owners make alot of money and management is not trying hard enough and Santulli is rich, doesnt persuade me to support your cause.

And now you tell me, the head of the MEC won't even look at the numbers? How else can we know what is going on for real if the top union elected guy doesnt look and make good judgements on the pilots behalf? If he doesnt look than it is easy to say BB is lying. Because really he doesnt know.

I know this is wordy, it may seem inflammatory but it is truly meant to continue your dialogue.

 

[netjetwife]

The MEC member sits in on the negotiations. Local 1108 has a (VERY) dedicated team of negotiators ---3 of their own-- who are savvy businessmen that understand the ins and outs of the industry, and NJA in particular. They have seen everything the company has presented. To say that the leader who left the room didn't miss much, is borne out by the negotiator's report that we all received via the board. The team is backed up by experts. The MEC, can and will, augment the negotiators' skills with researchers and consultants, as needed. Just as StrongUnion is far more than the name of a slate of leaders, the bargaining team has access to far more talent than is shown at the table. From the negotiators, to the MEC, to the committee chairs--the pilot force is well pleased with their representatives. Unity has never been stronger.

 

[SeaSpray]

It's ironic that the non-union pilots were able to negotiate better compensation, workrules and basing than you could and now you want to force them into your union to share your good deal.

In some ways the Gulfstream guys at NJI are benefiting from pay by weight, but mainly it's just that accross the industry Gulfstream pilots are paid well.

It's interesting that the NJA Boeing pilots have formed their own company with a separate pay scale starting at $135K and make up to $213K for flying a larger aircraft, but you guys never mention that. Really, ask yourselves why is there a split here?

NJI's pilots are poorly paid in the GWizz world, they don't negotiate for anything. They get what Santulli wants to give them.

Even our old limp d**ked MEC managed to get a pretty good deal for our senior guys in the BBJ. NJA operates the BBJ's, in twenty years I'll be able to hold one. A little fact checking next time before you make a fool of yourself.

Same seniority list, different work rules, different pay.

 

[x402]

OK, one more time with smaller words.....




It's ironic that the non-union pilots were able to negotiate better compensation, workrules and basing than you could and now you want to force them into your union to share your good deal.


NJI, do not negotiate. Mr Santulli gives them what he wants to give them. They are UNDERPAID compared to most G4-G5 drivers.



It's interesting that the NJA Boeing pilots have formed their own company with a separate pay scale starting at $135K and make up to $213K for flying a larger aircraft, but you guys never mention that. Really, ask yourselves why is there a split here?

The BBJ pilots are NJA pilots. The agreement (LOA) spells out the compensation for these pilots. It is bidable and they are on NJA's senority list.

Is this too hard to follow?

 

[dsptchrnja]

Netjets pilots are not your enemys.

Then you must be our friends.

Wait... No friend of mine will put my job in jeapordy for his own personal benifit. Sorry, but you wreak of hypocrosy.

Conversely, who said anything about being an enemy in the first place? The only people I've heard bring up the topic are NJA pilots.

Let's make it simple (again). You won't find too many people in the Casino who won't support a pay raise for crews. That's never been the issue for them. Most people never cared until recently when the issue of the strike came up. That is what people are concerned with - not your paycheck. See, we can be just as selfish. Most really only care about there own livlihood when it comes down to it.

It's not what you want, it's what you threaten to do if you don't get it. This quote sound familiar from anyone you know recently???

“Suck it up, we’re at war here!” So the flow of information will be unrelenting until our objectives are achieved or the doors are closed." [emphasis mine]

So whose the real threat? If the company gets their way Casino employees are safe - if the pilots don't get what they want - sounds like the only thing they care about at that point is revenge. Ya, keep trying to make me us feel like you're the victim and you're on our side.

We are asking for and will not accept anything less that what NJI has. How can the company claim we woud go out of business to pay us more, then on the other hand pay another section of the company in this manner. NJI flys from home, I thought this would break the company? Really, ask yourselves why is there a split here?

Fact is you don't know what the bottom line is for either company - it's all perception until Union leaders actually want to look at the facts. Very telling that they continue to refuse the company's offer for the books to be opened by a third party.

You ask why one of our MEC would not sign a non-disclosure form. This union has said they always will keep the lines of comunication truthful and OPEN. The fact that this man would not sign it, even though it would make him look bad to some people, should show you the resolve and INTEGRITY of this man. A man of lesser character may have broken, signed it, and broke his promise to the pilot group. I applaud him. You should too.

I'm rather pleased with him myself. If he continues to keep it up - the threat of a strike becomes less and less likely as the mediator can clearly see that the union is unwilling to have reasonable discussions and look over vital financial information. In order for the union to release you to strike, Netjets has to be found faulty at some point in the bargaining process. So far, that just isn't happening - no matter how badly you want to punish the company for not paying you what you want.

You're paying them to bargain a new contract - seems like that isn't even on the unions mind anymore (or the pilots they represent) - I could be wrong. The non-disclusure issue seems to make that case. What's more important? Do you want all the nitty-gritty details or do you trust your MEC chairman to handle the facts on his own and get you a new contract? Non-disclosures shouldn't become a road block in these kinds of negotiations.

You ask why we will not believe the chosen books provided by management, when they do not contain much of the truth. Does it show the 57 dollar quarts of oil at our own facilties, does it show the overpricing that FlightSafety charges Netjets? That money goes from one BKS pocket to another. Is that money shown on the profit line. Who insures our airplanes? Is it a BKS company? Are they competitive rates or is money shifting pockets there too? What about the money customers pay up front for engine reserves, they pay up front and the engines are done every 4 or 5 years. What is the interest on that amount of money? Is it shown on the profit line? How bout the loans to NJE? Are they paying them back? With Interest? A zero interest loan would save the company millions wouldnt it? Would that be shown on the profit line?
There are so many more examples. Can you honestly tell me that this isnt happening? If so, you are naive.

Can you say you know the motives, reasons, facts, figures behind all the business decisions? Did they ask for your advice?

PLEASE... stick to flying planes. That's all they need you for.

You ask why we would take this job and yell about the pay 7 years later. I took this job to build time and leave. RTS spoke at Hamilton road in my first year. Yes Brideway was not even a dream then. He told me and about 100 pilots directly, that he would make this the place to be in aviation. He told us he realized the pay was low and it would change. He spoke with such conviction, I, and a lot of pilots belevied him. ITS BEEN 7 YEARS. Time for him to put up or shut up. I have done my part to keep this gorrilla growing. It is his turn. Is he the type of man that will go back on his word? Does he have half the integrity our union leadership does? We will find out.

Alot of you have become unwitting pawns the company is using against the pilots. This is sad. Believe half what you hear from management and realize even the true parts will be spun. Please keep posting your questions, but with the tone that is used most of the time, its hard to believe that you dont see why most pilots see it as flame.

Funny, the only one trying to tell me how I should feel is pilot groups. I started thinking for myself quite a while ago.

 

[Lancair]

Not that it has any bearing on us because I think it's to late. When UPS Pilots went on strike they had the support of the truck drivers. 2 years later the pilots did the same for the drivers. The company is just trying to feed everyone a line so that we stay divided. Do you really think anyone in management has our best intrests at heart. I've just come from one failing airline hopping for the best here. If there is anything I've learned in my life is upper management cares only about the bottom line. That means more money for them and screw the people who helped get you there. So if your in the casino don't believe everything you here from the company. Most pilots would love to make this a great place to stay.

 

[x402]

Can you say you know the motives, reasons, facts, figures behind all the business decisions? Did they ask for your advice?

PLEASE... stick to flying planes. That's all they need you for.


The more of this I see, the less I worry about folks upstairs. Keep drinking that koolaid, Bill and Rich would be proud. There are lots of jobs at the Limited loading trucks. That should see you throught any difficulties in the future.
I'm sorry I'm not as PC as 750, but your harrassing posts don't leave much room for compassion.

 

[dsptchrnja]

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It's interesting that the NJA Boeing pilots have formed their own company with a separate pay scale starting at $135K and make up to $213K for flying a larger aircraft, but you guys never mention that. Really, ask yourselves why is there a split here?

The BBJ pilots are NJA pilots. The agreement (LOA) spells out the compensation for these pilots. It is bidable and they are on NJA's senority list.

Is this too hard to follow?

Mr. X, any particular reason you had to quote this guy again and tell us again what you arleady stated once?

Give it a rest. Besides, you're all being a little harsh. He never said BBJ pilots weren't from NJA - in fact he said NJA BOEING PILOTS.

That being said, it is TRUE that Boeing is technically a separate company from NJA - that's why it's called NJLA. That's why they have their own FOM seperate from yours.

And it is true they have their own payscale. So why are you jumping his case rather than just answering his question?