AWA or Frontier???

[sluggo]

I have opportunities at both airlines...I've been hired at F9 & I hear class is ~1/2006. As far as America West, I have an excellent contact and the ball is rolling. If I we're to get hired at AWA....I was just wondering what the better airline would be, F9 Vs. AWA. I am really good at making poor decisions in this business, so I thought I'd throw this out there to see what you guys who know these airlines think. Thanks, Sluggooo

 

[Cactus73]

I have opportunities at both airlines...I've been hired at F9 & I hear class is ~1/2006. As far as America West, I have an excellent contact and the ball is rolling. If I we're to get hired at AWA....I was just wondering what the better airline would be, F9 Vs. AWA. I am really good at making poor decisions in this business, so I thought I'd throw this out there to see what you guys who know these airlines think. Thanks, Sluggooo

Tough one.

Our CEO (Doug Parker) has been very upfront about his desire to find a merger partner. Being on the bottom of the seniority list is never a good place in this type of situation.

On the flip side, F9 may need a partner themselves if fuel prices remain this high.


I would choose by where you live. If you live in PHX or LAS choose AWA. If Denver is better for you then choose F9.

In the end, go to the airline that hires you first. Seniority is everything.

 

[USMC319]

sluggo,

Where do you live, or where do you want to live? F-9 is a great place to work, the equipment is all brand-new, the corporate culture is SWA 20 years ago, and I think the pay and benefits are a little better than AWA. In this case I would choose based on domicile, keeping in mind that at AWA you will most likely be part of a merger or buy-out in the next several years and you know how those operations can go. Definately take the first opportunity and then evaluate options as they present themselves.

 

[cactuspilot]

No brainer. F9

 

[VABB]

Eventually you will be on the AWA seniority list either way. If you go to AWA now, you will start gaining seniority there. If you go to Frontier, you will more than likely be stapled to the bottom of the AWA seniority list someday, if Frontier doesen't get sold/bought out/merged before that.


America West will offer you more stability, better pay, and it's an all-around far superior airline.

But, if Frontier calls first, take the job. You can always leave them for Cactus when you get the call.

 

[Jimdandy]

I could see F9 buying out AWA but not the other way around AWA is in really bad shape. They will be bankrupt by years end possibly.

 

[crashpad]

I don't know about AWA, but I'll throw this in the crap shoot.
F9 has very young Captains (many are still in their nappies), so upgrade is only going to happen with super expansion or merger, and both are unlikely.
Flipside: Good pay, planes, people, schedules, hotels, inflight food and TV. If I had to bet on your future here, I'd say you'll have a good one.

 

[AnimalTale]

Eventually you will be on the AWA seniority list either way. If you go to AWA now, you will start gaining seniority there. If you go to Frontier, you will more than likely be stapled to the bottom of the AWA seniority list someday, if Frontier doesen't get sold/bought out/merged before that.


America West will offer you more stability, better pay, and it's an all-around far superior airline.

But, if Frontier calls first, take the job. You can always leave them for Cactus when you get the call.

1) Frontier has no debt or creative financing like AWA. If you look at the size of both airlines, take into consideration the number of a/c and debt, F9 is financially in much better shape and poised to survive this downturn quicker. Remember, if the sh#t hits the fan MORE, we can take the financing avenue.
2) Pay wise, F9s pay is better than Cactus. Our hourly pay is better. I know Cactus pilots fly higher credit months, but f9 pilots get paid 125% of the higher hourly pay to fly above 81 hours. VABB get your facts right before you start typing next time.
3) I love AWA. I have a lot of friends there. Through conversations and observations, I think F9 is a much happier place.
4)I think the bottom line is, go with your gut. VABB said "AWA is a far more superior airline".This statement to me is pure ignorance. I flew for two, so called, "SUPRIOR" airlines. Today, they are no longer what they where and I truly enjoy the culture and flying at F9.
5) If you like PHX, go AWA. If you like DEN, go F9.

By the way, rumor is hiring should start b4 2006. We have 48 airplanes and 540 pilots (growing to 62 a/c with 23 options). As a pilot group, we fly a lot of overtime voluntarly. We like our overtime incentives and our skedules are very good. As you can see our crewutilization is very high. This is why hiring has been slowed. Our crew utilization is another reason why F9 has never furloughed. So for stability, I think , once you are hired, this is a great place.

Cya

 

[F9 Driver]

Sluggo,

Go with whichever hires you first.

I’ve got friends at AWA, and they are very happy there, but are looking at loooong upgrade times I believe.

Life is good for us here at Frontier – I get my nappies at cost – but growth plans are on hold for the foreseeable future with only two new planes for calendar ’05. So upgrade won’t be for a while here either.

AWA has a better scheduling system/contract from what I’ve seen.

I’d rather gnaw off my arm than commute. So I’d put location high up on the list too.

 

[VABB]

1) Frontier has no debt or creative financing like AWA. If you look at the size of both airlines, take into consideration the number of a/c and debt, F9 is financially in much better shape and poised to survive this downturn quicker. Remember, if the sh#t hits the fan MORE, we can take the financing avenue.
2) Pay wise, F9s pay is better than Cactus. Our hourly pay is better. I know Cactus pilots fly higher credit months, but f9 pilots get paid 125% of the higher hourly pay to fly above 81 hours. VABB get your facts right before you start typing next time.
3) I love AWA. I have a lot of friends there. Through conversations and observations, I think F9 is a much happier place.
4)I think the bottom line is, go with your gut. VABB said "AWA is a far more superior airline".This statement to me is pure ignorance. I flew for two, so called, "SUPRIOR" airlines. Today, they are no longer what they where and I truly enjoy the culture and flying at F9.
5) If you like PHX, go AWA. If you like DEN, go F9.

By the way, rumor is hiring should start b4 2006. We have 48 airplanes and 540 pilots (growing to 62 a/c with 23 options). As a pilot group, we fly a lot of overtime voluntarly. We like our overtime incentives and our skedules are very good. As you can see our crewutilization is very high. This is why hiring has been slowed. Our crew utilization is another reason why F9 has never furloughed. So for stability, I think , once you are hired, this is a great place.

Cya

F9 has no debt? So, Frontier paid CASH for all of those new Airbuses? They own outright all of their GSE and gates??

Frontier may not have creative financing, but they are financed. And it doesent' matter if you call it creative or any other thing, debt is debt. And at the end of the day, you owe your creditors.

I think you need to review your facts. Frontier is still in debt, just not as bad as other small airlines of comparable size. But, their debt load is still bad nonetheless.