Turned down a CAL job offer today

[bearcat]

I never thought I would be turning down a job offer from a legacy airline, but I turned down a CAL job today to hold out for a better airline.

I've heard of too many people leaving there recently, and I cannot bring myself to take the massive pay-cut and no insurance for 6-months when I know that I can probably get an interview with SWA, UPS, FedEx, DAL, UAL, etc. in the near future.

I am making good money right now, so I would rather not settle for working under such a horrible contract. I agree that it will probably get better there, but probably not for a while.

Am I going to regret it?

You will if you don't get hired at any of the others you mentioned...a bird in hand....

 

[Glacialfury1906]

I agree with Pocono and Fins. Some of you guys are way off base, and coming off quite irrational. I'd like to interview at CAL, and I'd probably go if hired and make a career of it. The earnings hit, however, isn't as temporary as many make it out to be. The financial hole you create isn't filled when your earnings simply catch up to what they were. I've been running some numbers and I think Fins numbers may even be on the low side as to how long it'd take to break even... especially considering the looming age 65 change that seems (unfortunately) inevitable in the next 5 years. Open skies seems like a certainty in the next 10 years as well, I don't think that will help the scenario.

If you think you're going to leave CAL, then I certainly wouldn't take the pay cut to go... because you'll never make the money back before you leave. Even for the 737 type, whats a 737 type cost, 8k? You're talking an initial 40k+ pay cut for an 8k type.

Just the unfortunate financial facts. This is assuming you've got 5+ years at one of the better (relatively speaking) regionals. Obviously a Great Lakes FO isn't going to use the same equation.

Is CAL's contract going to be exactly the same forever? Are they never, ever for the rest of your career going to get a pay raise or a better contract at CAL? Is your "good" regional never, ever going to take a pay cut and will always be there till you retire? Are you going to have a bad day the day you finally land that huge FEDEX interview and not be offered the job?

It's funny when i hear guys "running the numbers" on their career. Like everybody's contract is going to be exactly where it is for the remaining 20,25,30,35 years of your career. People can't be that short sighted. Especially when you fly for a vendor....

I'm sure it will all work out for all of us.......

 

[gcsass]

with age 65 coming and open skies already here(..in 08) I would grab a chair now before the music stops...but I could be wrong.......

 

[Phrogs4ever]

For the last time...

...you will not be without medical insurance at CAL for six months. You will be on a supplemental plan that provides full medical coverage. I covered my family for $230/month with a $1000 deductable.

First year pay sucks, but will be addressed in the near future. I still grossed over $40,000 without trying. The wife worked part time and we lived on a sensible budget. Not the ideal situation, but very workable. Grossed $72,000 second year on the 737.

You will be able to hold any domicile in no more than six months.

To say that "many" people are leaving is not an accurate statement. Some people have left during the first year when it is easier to do so, for companies that have better pay and work rules. We WILL be that company in two years (or so).

Big retirements in the near future. Even considering the Age 65 rule, we'll retire another 400 over the next year and a half.

Over 65 airplanes arriving over the next two years, net growth of ~50 planes. All of which are LNB or widebody.

If a bid came out today, I could hold EWR Captain! Two years on property.

During indoc, we were told hiring would be strong through 2010 then start to taper down a bit. People told me they were blowing smoke and it won't last. Well, two years later we are still hiring strong and will still go into the summer understaffed. Unless something major happens, this train is going to keep on rolling.

The loads are continually going up, and with a shift in the pilot culture I have absolute confidence in getting a substantial boost in overall QOL with our next contract.

All that being said, I do love working here but we have a long way to go. I'd much rather be on the inside of the company working to make it a great place to be while gaining seniority in leaps and bounds, than on the outside poo-pooing the shortcomings and waiting for a job that someone else had to fight hard to make great land in my lap.

 

[thor2j]

I think your numbers for how long it will take you to recoup are a little off. I was at Eagle for 12 years, making almost 100k. Yes first year at CAL sucks but after 3 years hourly rate is comparable, and I figure 5-6 to make back what I lost. Also until very recently UPS was even lower than CAL starting pay, nobody was saying lets pass that up.

SWA is a great company, but I have seen the numbers. If you do a 25 year total pay to total pay with CAL the numbers are within $50k (SWA ahead of course). Not much when spread over 25 years. Hourly rate is better at SWA for the first 5 years or so, then it becomes a little closer. At cal you have a 12.75% B fund(soon). Not counting 401ks or anything , just company payed stuff. And hopefully CALs pay has nowhere to go but up(hopefully), SWA is already at top. Not saying they will go down, but they maybe flat for a while.

To each is own, but passing up a major to me is something that is really hard to do. There are many people that will never make it to that level.

 

[Powda5]

You look at first year pay, but have you considered 4th year pay as a captain at CAL? Or maybe you just want to sit on the 777 at $99 an hour at that point (if I remember right). It's not even a long shot, and since it appears your decision is monetarily based, you would have looked at this, no? It really negates the 1st year pay in the decision making process you used in your post.

If you're wanting to go to UAL, uh...you're going to start at low pay rates, too, and their contract is up in '09, merger talks are dying down but they are in a rough spot to come in as a newhire. By the time you were hired there, it is likely to be 6 months to a year from now anyway....time you could have been ticking off at CAL. That first year pay at all airlines is so similar....even F9 is in the 30/hr range. It isn't acceptable, but I can't see how it's a deciding factor. It is really more of a 'that's really going to suck' factor.

 

[ERJpusher]

Sure, luv life working your a$$ off..believe it or not SWA isn't for everyone.

You're right, working hard for a living isn't for everyone (see "democrat"). But I can put in a full work month that pays over 100 and get 19 days off. How many days per month do you have to work for the same pay?

If I'm at work, I want to work. I don't want to spend time away from my family just sitting around in some stupid hotel.

 

[johnny taliban]

Bullsh*t dude - do whatever you think is best for you. No one has to turn down any job they will enjoy, whatever the pay is. That's called freedom, Mr. Taliban. Nice name by the way.

lighten up francis,

and whats with the language, I thought this was a family board. The name is a joke since you obviously don't get the humor. Let me help you out. In my profile you will see that my current position is "behind bars". You see, I am making fun of the real johnny taliban. Get it? And before you get on your high horse about serving your country let me state that I did as well.

good day

 

[GogglesPisano]

AA pilots just asked for a 30% raise. Contracts can and do change.

 

[GogglesPisano]

...you will not be without medical insurance at CAL for six months. You will be on a supplemental plan that provides full medical coverage. I covered my family for $230/month with a $1000 deductable.

.

Is this what they offer in Indoc? Are those numbers fairly accurate?

Thanks