Procedure Turn Question

[maverick_fp00]

I was flying the VOR 18 @ TLH (Tallahassee) Sunday morning and approach told me to "Keep it in tight." Since he told me that, I just wasn't going to go out as far on the outbound before the procedure turn. Instead, the guy I was flying with (a CFII) told me to just make the procedure turn left instead of right to keep it in tight. Did I miss something, or is that legal? Normally, everybody makes a right procedure turn.

Thanks

 

[LongBoarder]

As long as you turn on the protected side.... you can turn left or right.... if the initial turn heading is 90 and the prcedure turn inbound heading is 180...... it does not matter if you turn left or right... completing the left turn just might make the intercept hard...

LB

 

[midlifeflyer]

I was flying the VOR 18 @ TLH (Tallahassee) Sunday morning and approach told me to "Keep it in tight." Since he told me that, I just wasn't going to go out as far on the outbound before the procedure turn. Instead, the guy I was flying with (a CFII) told me to just make the procedure turn left instead of right to keep it in tight. Did I miss something, or is that legal? Normally, everybody makes a right procedure turn.

Thanks

I took a look at the chart. You've lost me. Heading outbound from the IAF, the barb is on the left.

 

[tarp]

Mark,

I think he means he turned inbound or inside toward the airport instead of turning outside away from the airport.

i.e. the barb was to the left and after timing one minute outbound on the barb, they turned left to make the procedure inbound rather than right as would be normal.

Maverick

You should have stayed with your gut and just gone out one minute from the fix, made the normal procedure turn and then inbound. You stood a chance by turning back in on the barb that you would miss the waypoint (fix) or would not gain the course (173) until right on top of the FAF (SZW). Winds do funny things when in that procedure turn.

The FAA doesn't care too much what you do out there to make a course reversal as long as you stay on the "holding" side or protected airspace. If you notice on every other chart for TLH the holding pattern is usually built on the 002 radial and hold to the NW. i.e. NW is the protected side.

Depending on when Approach told you to "keep it tight", you could have even done a teardrop holding pattern entry on SZW (the FAF) and then continued inbound on the 173 to the airport. This would have consumed the least amount of time of any procedure turn you could have made. Not standard, but still a course reversal in the FAA's guide.

Normally, seeing this depiction, I would cross SZW (FAF) time "out" 1 minute, procedure turn outbound (1 min on the 308 hdg), std rate 180 right turn (1 min to 128 hdg) and fly 128 until needle swings to center on the 173 inbound. The result is about 4 minutes outside SZW. The holding pattern entry reduced this tho 3 mins. Your "friends" technique would have made a whole lot of work for you, especially with winds from the North or East aloft.

PS. When shooting the "miss" did you use ADF or GPS?

 

[bobbysamd]

Procedure Turns

I didn't look at the plate, but I can tell you that (in the real world) you can make any kind of procedure turn that you like, as long as you remain in protected airspace. I.e. on the side where the barb is depicted. You make make an 80/260, teardrop, racetrack, or standard procedure turn.

I do second Tarp. Do it the way that you were probably taught, i.e. going out a minute and executing a standard PT. I remember trying it the opposite way and getting screwed-up big time.

One other suggestion. On the CHECKRIDE, do everything the standard, FAA way. I.e., if you see a normal barb on the IAP, execute a standard procedure turn. The examiner will expect to see that kind of turn. Anything different, although acceptable by all authorities, will likely raise the examiner's eyebrow. No matter how right you may be, when it comes to checkrides, never surprise the examiner. Doing so is like trying to fool Mother Nature - it's not nice.

 

[midlifeflyer]

I think he means he turned inbound or inside toward the airport instead of turning outside away from the airport.

Ah! Got it! Thanks!

 

[maverick_fp00]

Thanks a lot guys for the responses! So in reality, the barb doesn't mean sh!t. As long as you do the procedure turn on the safe side, you can do whatever type you want.

Thanks Again.


After you received your licenses and ratings is when you really start to learn!

 

[bobbysamd]

Not exactly . . . .

So in reality, the barb doesn't mean sh!t.

The barb signifies the safe side of the procedure. So, it does mean something, i.e., the safe side. The rest of your statement is true.

After you received your licenses and ratings is when you really start to learn!

That is 100% accurate. Just wait til you start instructing. You will be amazed at how much you learn.

Good luck with your flying.