Air Force to UAL New Hire

[Russ]

No but it makes him or her far more familiar with 121 operations, regs, OPSPECs, busy airports, quick turns and dealing with other work groups specific to the airlines.

All skills learned quickly by the mil guys, but out of the box the civ guys have the advantage. I'm a LCA at my airline (not a major) and deal with new hires from both backgrounds. The civ guys pick up on things quicker, the mil guys tend to listen more as they know they're at a disadvantage.
There are plenty of examples of mil pilots gooning up and becoming statistics, Bud Holland, the C-5 crew crashing out of the dreaded three engine approach with a good engine throttled back or even the C-12 in Afghanistan highlighted in the March edition of Flying magazine. Without doubt someone can point to crashes caused by civ pilots. All it will do is prove the point that we have more in common than a superiority of either in the long run.

 

[waveflyer]

Who spent more time actually flying? Takeoff-Autopilot-Land equates to how much ACTUAL flight time, in say a three hour period? Maybe 20 minutes? A fighter pilot with 1500 hours spent most of those 1500 hours actually manipulating the controls, you know flying, not complaining about their schedule, playing with their phone, or reading the paper.

So...advantage the B1900 or jet stream driver who tackled northeast winters with no autopilot 7 legs a day??

I thought they were unqualified bc they didn't have glass and jets?

You guys have an excuse for everything. An excuse for why any civilian experience is worse than military, and an excuse for why any military experience is better than civilian.

Cut the crap and just be honest about it being a hook up

 

[AirCobra]

So...advantage the B1900 or jet stream driver who tackled northeast winters with no autopilot 7 legs a day??

I thought they were unqualified bc they didn't have glass and jets?

You guys have an excuse for everything. An excuse for why any civilian experience is worse than military, and an excuse for why any military experience is better than civilian.

Cut the crap and just be honest about it being a hook up

Not sure what you are trying to say and what you mean by excuse. I am talking about actual flying expereince, you remember the stuff we do for a few minutes before we hit the "on" button, not sitting motionless for two hours. Do I think a experienced Jetstream guy has more "flying" expereince than a RJ guy with the same time TT. Yes. I also think SWA guys have more real flying expereince than someone who flies transcontinental or international. A SWA guy lands more than once every 12 hours I think.

If I were running a place like FedEx or UPS with a lot of old jets I would be more inclined to look at someone who did a lot of "flying" rather than button pushing. What some military pilots have to offer is a lot of actual hands on flying, along with glass cockpit experience, so in that respect getting a C-130J, C-17, or F-16 guy with less TT than an RJ guy is probably a better deal experience wise. They have two skills. And just like our previous discussion even with helo guys (which to you might as well be a hot air balloon or glider) "flying" a multi crew, 18,000 lb turbine powered aircraft with a glass cockpit is more applicable to airline flying than being a CFI in a C-172. Too bad you fail to see it that way, but if you had done both you would understand.

A lot of people here have done both, you haven't. Rather than jumping to conclusions and talking about conspiracies or networks why don't you ask around and make informed decisions. The very fact you have a job unvalidates your hook up theory, doesn't it?

 

[bluesideup1]

Not sure what you are trying to say and what you mean by excuse. I am talking about actual flying expereince, you remember the stuff we do for a few minutes before we hit the "on" button, not sitting motionless for two hours. Do I think a experienced Jetstream guy has more "flying" expereince than a RJ guy with the same time TT. Yes. I also think SWA guys have more real flying expereince than someone who flies transcontinental or international. A SWA guy lands more than once every 12 hours I think.

If I were running a place like FedEx or UPS with a lot of old jets I would be more inclined to look at someone who did a lot of "flying" rather than button pushing. What some military pilots have to offer is a lot of actual hands on flying, along with glass cockpit experience, so in that respect getting a C-130J, C-17, or F-16 guy with less TT than an RJ guy is probably a better deal experience wise. They have two skills. And just like our previous discussion even with helo guys (which to you might as well be a hot air balloon or glider) "flying" a multi crew, 18,000 lb turbine powered aircraft with a glass cockpit is more applicable to airline flying than being a CFI in a C-172. Too bad you fail to see it that way, but if you had done both you would understand.

A lot of people here have done both, you haven't. Rather than jumping to conclusions and talking about conspiracies or networks why don't you ask around and make informed decisions. The very fact you have a job unvalidates your hook up theory, doesn't it?

I think most civilian guys have more time hand flying a C172 than military guys have total time. So, if hand flying is where it is at I think you need to try again.

 

[sat74]

I thought FedEx thought anyone with over 6000 hours as untrainable?

 

[Turtle21]

So why would such low time not make you less qualified?

The qualification is, at the very most, an ATP and FE written. Anything else is all subjective. It isn't up to me, so I have already wasted more brain cells on this thread than I can afford.

 

[Mamma]

Wave,
I see what you are saying and empathize with you. It can be frustrating. But, for you to disparage military pilots as being substandard, arrogant and not deserving discredits you and makes me question your abilities. Hours are not everything management is looking for. They are looking long-term and have a certain criteria they desire. If you want to whine, don't get upset with the mil guy, voice your concerns to management who hires them. I'm sure they will tell you to pound sand but then again, maybe not.

 

[Mamma]

.......

 

[Mamma]

So...advantage the B1900 or jet stream driver who tackled northeast winters with no autopilot 7 legs a day??

I thought they were unqualified bc they didn't have glass and jets?

You guys have an excuse for everything. An excuse for why any civilian experience is worse than military, and an excuse for why any military experience is better than civilian.

Cut the crap and just be honest about it being a hook up

You sound like a jilted lover with a tiny wang. But the Camaro and mirrored aviator glasses make you look cool!

Sounds like SWA is not exactly what you've been advertising. I mean, you despise and loathe an awful lot of your captains and fellow FOs for their "unfair" advantage in life. Those free-loading SOBs who never earned anything! How do you go to work day in and day out?

 

[waveflyer]

I thought FedEx thought anyone with over 6000 hours as untrainable?

Another excuse to not hire civilians^^

And speaking of fedex air cobra-

Their safety record is pretty awful- and we all know their military hiring preference