Hey XJET guys...

Thebadcat1313

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Thanks..How would that play out with your current ALPA representation? Would it require a decertification of ALPA? The main argument here against the independent union is that the cost would be prohibitive, but when you have all 5000 pilots paying dues it would be a different ballgame..
7500 if you include SkyWest Airlines.
 

wms

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Decertification of ALPA isn't gonna happen. There are benefits of having ALPA on the property like aeromedical and legal that in house unions don't do as well. Also, the boys club style association that Skywest currently has just doesn't get the job done.

You have to understand that we've had the type of mgmt that doesn't care about agreements, rules or regs and we need the advocacy of an organization that will fight hard when necessary.

The ASA mec has not been tough enough in the past, but hopefully with the e145 guys here we will have some representation that will fight harder.
 
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FishandFly

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Decertification of ALPA isn't gonna happen. There are benefits of having ALPA on the property like aeromedical and legal that in house unions don't do as well. Also, the boys club style association that Skywest currently has just doesn't get the job done.

You have to understand that we've had the type of mgmt that doesn't care about agreements, rules or regs and we need the advocacy of an organization that will fight hard when necessary.

The ASA mec has not been tough enough in the past, but hopefully with the e145 guys here we will have some representation that will fight harder.

There is enough negativity about alpa here that I think most people would vote for an in house union option.

I believe that one list would result in a group that would move forward our qol in a levelheaded and effective way.
 

TEXAN AVIATOR

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Alpa isn't the problem. Think of it like a big corporation that sells franchises and supports those franchises when needed. Each pilot group runs their 'franchise' EX - XJT MEC, ASA MEC, CAL MEC, DAL MEC. You run your MEC how you see fit. If we got rid of ALPA you'd still have the same guys in those union offices doing the work. If you want to change things, the name won't fix anything... Get rid of the guys you elected and the MEC chairman they elected on your behalf. Getting rid of ALPA is a statement guys make when they don't know what they are talking about. Costs would go up, and most likely we'd see no improvements.
 

Plainsman

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Are you on some alpa committee that gets you out of flying? Sounds like it.
 
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TEXAN AVIATOR

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Are you on some alpa committee that gets you out of flying? Sounds like it.
Nope. I'm a line pilot and I've never been in trouble with the company or on any committee. I just fly the line, pay my dues and go home.
 

Baronman

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There is enough negativity about alpa here that I think most people would vote for an in house union option.

I believe that one list would result in a group that would move forward our qol in a levelheaded and effective way.
An in-house union sounds great until you realize we'll have fewer services and resources available to us with the same people representing us.

It would give the alpa-haters the warm and fuzzies though.....
 

wms

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There is enough negativity about alpa here that I think most people would vote for an in house union option.

I believe that one list would result in a group that would move forward our qol in a levelheaded and effective way.
An in house union would become the same boys club that Skywest has now, with anti-ALPA pilots that would cave on QOL issues to avoid rocking the boat.

Also, the most important factor is you're thinking inside the ASA/Atl box. The fact is there are over 2500 e145 pilots that will NEVER vote out ALPA.
 

dojetdriver

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The ORD crews have lost a considerable amount here already since XJT got here, not that there's bad feeling against them, but it's a fact our lines in ORD have been cut in half.
Sucks for the ORD OO pilots.

The sad truth is this; My former company, along with Air Wisconsin was the ORD UAX provider. Then the BK came, and SkyWest, along with Mesa, TSA, CHQ, etc under bid the crap out of the flying. And then, the former UAX carriers were replaced. Now, another carrier is replacing a former UAX carrier in ORD, and other locations like DEN. While said carrier is seeing the flying they do moved to other locations.

It's the sad circle of life at a regional airline. So although I feel SkyWest pilots in ORD that are seeing their QOL diminish, it's a little hard for me to feel sympathy for them, or ANY other UAX carrier that has seen the flying they did there replace by another outsourced contract lift provider.

Or simply put another way, karma is a b1tch motherfukcers. They all jumped for joy at the growth/expansion/upgrades that were received at the expense of other airline's demise during UAL's BK. Now it comes full circle. Get used to it. As long as you're at a regional airline, that will be the story of your career.

I apologize if that sounded crass or harsh. But if I have to hear another sob story from a SkyWest pilot or hear they're our "saviors", seriously, I'm not sure what I'm going to do. But needless to say, again, there's no sympathy for the situation ANY of us are in while were at a regional airline.
 
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TDK90

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Not looking for sympathy at all, just stating a fact. Most guys here like me took the first offer, I had RP and XE interviews scheduled. The biggest complainers at SkyWest without a doubt are the guys who jumped ship from ASA, S5 and XE, we have loads of those guys here lamenting their move...I have little sympathy for them.
 

mxaviator

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Apparently CT said some interesting things in the lounge. It sounds like they are really trying to minimize displacements and furloughs, at least what they are claiming and that's good if true.
Someone asked about the airplanes going to GoJets. In the answer he said we are losing 8 and SkyWest is losing 4, which we all knew. *****Obviously the hit we are having on the CRJ side is due to that AND the 6 200s coming out of the DAL system. We are left scrambling trying to figure out how not to downgrade and furlough or how many to downgrade and furlough. Which it sounds like they will make a final decision on sometime in January.
Then the question was asked "Have we been able to find work for those 6 200s?" His answer was this; those 200s are going to be transferred to SkyWest to fly for the US Air contract they recently got, citing that its better than paying a lease on planes that aren't flying. I agree with him that it's better not to be paying the lease on those airplanes but I have to ask the questions: When was SkyWest bidding on that contract? Did they bid on it planning on using those 6 200s?
Maybe its the conspiracy theorist side of me but it makes me wonder how hard ASA tried to find homes for those planes or if the plan was to transfer them to SkyWest from the beginning. Maybe the knew, based on our performance this past summer, they had no chance of placing those planes anywhere.
Looking at the end result we have a net loss of 14 planes and an airline they think is overstaffed while they end up with a net gain of 2 planes and plans to hire for the "foreseeable future." Then adding insult to injury, if pilots at ASA (concerned about getting furloughed) decide to work for SkyWest they keep their longevity for vacation and benefits but not pay, back to first year pay. That is if they pass the interview. I'm glad that SkyWest is able to grow but it shouldn't be at ASA's expense. I hope I'm wrong or maybe jumped to a misguided conclusion but it looks like whipsaw is in full swing.
 
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Skaff

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Wow. Where to start...? Ok how about this isn't about "us" before "you". It's about "you" riding our negotiating coattails and then being handed growth while "we" furlough. It's about securing a brighter future for all of us employed by SkyWest. Its really about the bigger picture; something you clearly don't see.

Also; before you go mouthing off about spiky hair and entitlement you should know your audience. Most of us are well into our 30s and early 40s. We have things like wives, and children, mortgages and car payments. And that sir, makes this one list drive all the more important.
Are you speaking of the coat tails that your airline can't afford to pay for because they can't pull a profit or the growth that we can afford because of the profits we make every quarter. If getting your company profitable requires furloughs, that really, really sucks. I'm sincere about that. But, if you re-read my initial post I stand by it. It would be stupid for SkyWest pilots to sign anything that puts Express Jet ahead of SkyWest pilots. Why would I do that? I've been here a long time because I want to be here. I have no interest in working for Express Jet.
 

Max Q

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So those 6 200's are going to Skywest and ASA might be furloughing?

That sounds familiar.
 

mxaviator

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So those 6 200's are going to Skywest and ASA might be furloughing?

That sounds familiar.
Then again, maybe our performance was so crappy this past summer nobody would talk to them about finding flying for those planes.
 

Master Shake

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@ Skaff - I've made my point. I'm not about to rebut your inaccuracies. But please feel free to fight merging our two lists. I know I'll be doing the exact opposite on my side.
 

wms

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So those 6 200's are going to Skywest and ASA might be furloughing?

That sounds familiar.
We have a fragmentation policy. 5 captains and 5 fo's go with each plane if more than 5 planes are transferred. That will help with staffing unless there is some loop hole to keep it from happening.
 

mxaviator

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We have a fragmentation policy. 5 captains and 5 fo's go with each plane if more than 5 planes are transferred. That will help with staffing unless there is some loop hole to keep it from happening.
Good point, I'm not sure how that would come into play here with the DAL contract on those planes ending or if that would even matter. Something to look into.
 

dojetdriver

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Not looking for sympathy at all, just stating a fact. Most guys here like me took the first offer, I had RP and XE interviews scheduled. The biggest complainers at SkyWest without a doubt are the guys who jumped ship from ASA, S5 and XE, we have loads of those guys here lamenting their move...I have little sympathy for them.
That's cool man.

I'll bet the biggest SKW complainers are the ones that got to see upgrades, growth, and new bases while their company was replacing other companies that did that flying on behalf of the mainline partner.

All this after they agreed to fly 700/900 equipment at 50 seat rates, as well as agreed to an 18 month pay freeze that actually ended up being about double that.
 

Jackie Moon

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We have a fragmentation policy. 5 captains and 5 fo's go with each plane if more than 5 planes are transferred. That will help with staffing unless there is some loop hole to keep it from happening.

I am sure our union will just give them a waiver since it is only 6 planes and we don't want to be stuck paying for them while they are not being used. I hope I didn't just give them the excuse they will use when they sell us out.
 
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