Endeavor to lose 38 CRJ-200s to Air Wisconsin and SKW

SpauldingSmails

Aboard the sloop.
Joined
Aug 26, 2005
Posts
1,278
Total Time
>7000
The company and union have both already said why the money is coming as a bonus and not a wage increase. "Business decisions relating to other DCI airlines" I.e. we can't show any contractual improvements until we use your contract to squeeze SkyWest and ExpressJet.
Alright, keep eatin' that sandwich.

You've been at XJ/9E since at least 2005 if you flew the Avro and worked under MAIR Holdings, you just downgraded, and you still take these folks at their word? How many broken promises over the years? 9E CRJs coming in '05, ASA 900s coming in '08, more jobs and better pay in '10, SSP - then ETD. I empathize with your plight, but I wouldn't trust those folks with my Tupperware.

I'm sure they have offered that explanation - but putting the squeeze on SKW and XJT is not mutually exclusive of winding down 9E operations.

I'd imagine SKW and XJT are probably soon to be the largest CRJ200 operators in the DAL system, if they aren't already. Why would DAL then transfer 9E 200s to ARW, an operator with higher costs?
 

gojo

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 12, 2006
Posts
327
Total Time
3000
Exactly. It makes no sense to send them to a more expensive Air Wisconsin. IMO it shows that Endeavor is headed down the Comair path when they start making moves like these. If they really wanted to make Endeavor an attractive place, even without future fleet growth, all they had to do was offer the equivalent of an EtD for current 9E pilots. Current pilots with a guaranteed flow into Delta. That would have been a zero-cost/neutral item and that would have instantly turned 9E around as it created a guaranteed no strings attached movement to Delta. But that's not happening either. Without raising payrates back to the JCBA and shuffling planes to more expensive airlines like Air Wis and SkyWest, Delta is not doing things that make 9E more attractive to work. Add in a payment that is the same regardless of seat or longevity, and it has all the looks of a stop-loss payment as a fleet is metered down.
Alright, keep eatin' that sandwich.

You've been at XJ/9E since at least 2005 if you flew the Avro and worked under MAIR Holdings, you just downgraded, and you still take these folks at their word? How many broken promises over the years? 9E CRJs coming in '05, ASA 900s coming in '08, more jobs and better pay in '10, SSP - then ETD. I empathize with your plight, but I wouldn't trust those folks with my Tupperware.

I'm sure they have offered that explanation - but putting the squeeze on SKW and XJT is not mutually exclusive of winding down 9E operations.

I'd imagine SKW and XJT are probably soon to be the largest CRJ200 operators in the DAL system, if they aren't already. Why would DAL then transfer 9E 200s to ARW, an operator with higher costs?
Jeez, where to start??? First there are 2007 hires captains on the 900. Mesaba did get 15 9e 200's. And Mesaba was never promised any ASA birds. They were however promised 15 Freedom 900's and then Delta reneged and ended up giving 10 to ASA.
 

SpauldingSmails

Aboard the sloop.
Joined
Aug 26, 2005
Posts
1,278
Total Time
>7000
Jeez, where to start??? First there are 2007 hires captains on the 900. Mesaba did get 15 9e 200's. And Mesaba was never promised any ASA birds. They were however promised 15 Freedom 900's and then Delta reneged and ended up giving 10 to ASA.
I stand corrected on the ASA 900s, nonetheless - I thought there were more than 15 of those 200s slated for XJ back in '05. In any case, the track record for expectations had not been rosy.
 

gojo

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 12, 2006
Posts
327
Total Time
3000
I stand corrected on the ASA 900s, nonetheless - I thought there were more than 15 of those 200s slated for XJ back in '05. In any case, the track record for expectations had not been rosy.

You're right about it not being rosy. In fact it's been down right $hitty. To further clarify, Mesaba was awarded 15 brand new 200's in 2005 with options for either 15 or 30 more, I can't remember. Anyway, soon after they got the 2nd one the filed for bankruptcy and the deliverys stopped. Of the two that were received, one was used to keep the Mesaba jet certificate alive after the Avros were parked, and the other was used to keep the Independence Air jet certificate alive which Northwest purchased for Compass. Coincidence?, I think not. A couple years later Mesaba was given 15 200's from 9e.
 

WMUSIGPI

The $100,000,000 Question
Joined
Jan 23, 2003
Posts
2,219
Total Time
5000+
I stand corrected on the ASA 900s, nonetheless - I thought there were more than 15 of those 200s slated for XJ back in '05. In any case, the track record for expectations had not been rosy.
We were supposed to get 20 200's in 05 with first rights to the next 15 in the NWA Airlink system as well. That actually turned out to be just 2 (601XJ and 602XJ) One of which was sent to "NewCo" to eventually be Compass. It did come back along with 17 of Pinnacle's eventually. And yes the 15 900s were originally Freedom's and were passed around like Tila Tequilla.
 

A-10_JetMech

There I Was
Joined
Sep 22, 2006
Posts
63
Total Time
27 Yrs
Read on APC this afternoon that the Air Wisky deal to fly for Delta is off. Wonder who they'll get now besides Skywest to cover the 200 flying that 9e can't.
 

WMUSIGPI

The $100,000,000 Question
Joined
Jan 23, 2003
Posts
2,219
Total Time
5000+
Nobody else currently operating the CRJ-200 is able to staff them, so... nobody will be flying them. Delta is getting exactly what they are paying... Nothing. :beer:
 

WMUSIGPI

The $100,000,000 Question
Joined
Jan 23, 2003
Posts
2,219
Total Time
5000+
Maybe Chautauqua will take on some more parked 145s or get their contract extended?
they have already announced they will park all their 145s and Q's in 2015 in favor of keeping the E175's staffed. So that isn't likely.
 

SoberIrishman

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 7, 2005
Posts
445
Total Time
14000+
I think ASA can currently staff those aircraft. Our 200 ops for united in Dulles stops soon, so we should have pilots.
Not many coming through the hiring pipeline however.
 

Freebrd

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 17, 2003
Posts
2,665
Total Time
44,000
DAL should've kept CMR going. Now Endeavor. And the COOs & VPs continue to get awarded for their great decisions.
 

gojo

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 12, 2006
Posts
327
Total Time
3000
DAL should've kept CMR going. Now Endeavor. And the COOs & VPs continue to get awarded for their great decisions.
That's what's wrong with corporate America now days. Ceo's and vp's are only looking ahead a short time and doing what makes them the most money.
 

Tank Commander

Jim "Tank Daddy" Bizzell
Joined
Jun 29, 2004
Posts
240
Total Time
20yr.
Not enough pilots to staff 200's...... Can you hear the sucking sound of hiring.....
And don't fool your selves. They knew it was coming, and I'm sure they have a backup plan. How ever, they will ride the old regional industry till the last penny is squeezed from it.
 

trip

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 22, 2002
Posts
878
Total Time
11000
Sounds like DL tried a fast and loose bait an switch with AWAC, I guess their gig is up and it's time to pay if they want the aircraft to move.
Good on AWAC for seeing it for what it was.
 

General Lee

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 24, 2002
Posts
20,442
Total Time
A lot
You can't even explain your own comment Shaun
Shaun is extremely frustrated and irritable. I wouldn't doubt his normal excuse is "I have cramps..."



Bye Bye---General Lee
 

redflyer65

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 1, 2004
Posts
4,455
Total Time
8000
I believe Delta paid over 2 BILLION dollars for Comair and then later liquidated them for nothing....as in zero.

What a great way to run your business.
 

CaptETWes

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 27, 2006
Posts
155
Total Time
8000+
Sounds like DL tried a fast and loose bait an switch with AWAC, I guess their gig is up and it's time to pay if they want the aircraft to move.
Good on AWAC for seeing it for what it was.

Word is our management wouldn't agree to some of Delta's typical demands, like tying a large part of the pay to completion factor, performance, etc. That's unrealistic since a large part of the flying is out of JFK. We have enough experience in the NE to know 99.5% minimum completion factor in that region is ridiculous. They allegedly worked through the weekend to reach an agreement. I wouldn't say the deal with ZW is completely dead because of all the work that has been put into prepping the first few planes. We're hoping this is just part of two well-run airlines going head to head. There's a reason we've been around for 50 years. It's not because we jump at everything that comes our way.
 
Top