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Are you a cocky pilot?

JustaNumber

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Okay, I'm just venting, but have you guys noticed a correlation between guys who, at some point on a trip, say "you know, this job is just not that hard," and then they prove to JUST SUCK as a pilot (especially the standardized part)? They can't accept suggestions (to avoid a major undesired state), and then make excuses for why it was all someone else's fault? I think it's a generational Millennials thing, but it boils down to, are you actually trying to be a better pilot with a little humility, or do you think you are God's gift to aviation already?

Sorry for the rant, just had to get that off my chest. I feel better now.
 

GogglesPisano

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Yep. I've seen that at the regional I used to work for. Not so much at the major. They're the first guys whose exceptional skill and decision making at this "easy job," gets them into a tight corner that only an ASAP can get them out of. The're lucky for a while, but eventually this easy job catches up with them one way another.
 

UnstableAviator

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No, it's not hard to do the job to the absolute minimum level.

But like most things in life, most pilots are just good enough, some are terrible, and very few are actually great.

And blaming "Millenials" just makes you sound like the old guy yelling "GET OFF MY LAWN".
 

Oakum_Boy

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have you guys noticed a correlation between guys who, at some point on a trip, say "you know, this job is just not that hard," and then they prove to JUST SUCK as a pilot (especially the standardized part)?
I've noticed and commented on that here before. I got a lot of flack for it too.

Have you heard this one:

"FUEL FLOW.....MANUAL"

Me: "I think that's FUEL *CROSS*-FLOW..."

Them: Eye roll. 'This job is too easy for details like that'
 
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JustaNumber

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And blaming "Millenials" just makes you sound like the old guy yelling "GET OFF MY LAWN".

Fair enough (although I'm not that old). But that doesn't mean I'm wrong about certain factual character traits of the Millenial generation (speaking in broad generalities as there are many exceptions of course).

Here's an excerpt from the recent Time Magazine article entitled "The Me Me Me Generation":

"The incidence of narcissistic personality disorder is nearly three times as high for people in their 20s as for the generation that?s now 65 or older, according to the National Institutes of Health; 58% more college students scored higher on a narcissism scale in 2009 than in 1982. Millennials got so many participation trophies growing up that a recent study showed that 40% believe they should be promoted every two years, regardless of performance."
 
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Flying Illini

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Fair enough (although I'm not that old). But that doesn't mean I'm wrong about certain factual character traits of the Millenial generation (speaking in broad generalities as there are many exceptions of course).

Here's an excerpt from the recent Time Magazine article entitled "The Me Me Me Generation":

"The incidence of narcissistic personality disorder is nearly three times as high for people in their 20s as for the generation that?s now 65 or older, according to the National Institutes of Health; 58% more college students scored higher on a narcissism scale in 2009 than in 1982. Millennials got so many participation trophies growing up that a recent study showed that 40% believe they should be promoted every two years, regardless of performance."
And do you know what generation is responsible for giving kids all of these damn "participation" trophies and rewarding losing and low-effort and instituting "no score keeping" leagues for your kids? What generation feels that kids, especially their kids can do no wrong? What generation never taught personal responsibility/responsibility for your own actions to their kids? Well, now those coddled kids are growing up and will have kids of their own and things will only snowball from there.

I'm in my mid-thirties and I see these behaviors in about a 50/50 split in other parents that I interact with. My kid will likely play in these leagues (because they all seem to be like that anymore) but you can bet that Mom and Dad will be keeping score. Parents want to be friends more and more. Kindler and Gentler parenting but that's not always better.
 

ASA_Aviator

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Yep, and I think correlated with that is this trend of not speaking up to a child misbehaving in public. Parents will jump your crap if you speak up to their child. We used to live in a society where any adult could speak up to a child in public, and I think that helped to show children that even when their parents aren't around, they still have to live up to cultural standards.

Maybe this will come full circle someday?
 

JustaNumber

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Yep, and I think correlated with that is this trend of not speaking up to a child misbehaving in public. Parents will jump your crap if you speak up to their child. We used to live in a society where any adult could speak up to a child in public, and I think that helped to show children that even when their parents aren't around, they still have to live up to cultural standards.

Maybe this will come full circle someday?
Okay, to bring your exact observation back to the cockpit, how many of you captains will correct an FO who exhibits this kind of behavior, vs just letting violations of standards go in the interests of making friends or just keeping peace in the cockpit? I know it's a fine line in terms of severity of consequences of whatever violation, but I'm curious how others handle this.
 

Flying Illini

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Okay, to bring your exact observation back to the cockpit, how many of you captains will correct an FO who exhibits this kind of behavior, vs just letting violations of standards go in the interests of making friends or just keeping peace in the cockpit? I know it's a fine line in terms of severity of consequences of whatever violation, but I'm curious how others handle this.
I'd ask the question of FO's that will speak up to the CA too.
 

flyboyike

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I think everyone sucks about equally, regardless of generation.
 

johnsonrod

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Honestly, as long as it doesn't impact overall safety, who cares???

Last thing I want to do is fly with a serious IT nerd type person. I don't mind cocky as long as it does not compromise safety... If you are cocky and clearly unsafe, then that is another story.
 

say again

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I'm always open to suggestions to better myself as a pilot, and reciprocate that with the people I fly with.
 

JustaNumber

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Honestly, as long as it doesn't impact overall safety, who cares???

Last thing I want to do is fly with a serious IT nerd type person. I don't mind cocky as long as it does not compromise safety... If you are cocky and clearly unsafe, then that is another story.
But is the average pilot a decent judge of whether any nonstandard procedure really compromises safety or not?

No one said anything about an IT nerd type person. What I'm talking about are the guys (and you all know them if you're not one of them) who don't believe in doing anything standard. I guess the reasoning is, "if it doesn't kill me when I take a short cut, why should I bother doing it the way it's supposed to be done?"

The problem with this is that often this leads you into test-pilot territory, without you even knowing it. For example, I recently flew with a guy who intentionally accelerated after T/O so that he was at Vt by 1000 agl. I guess it saved him from having to actually use his triceps all at once, or maybe he thought he was getting there sooner. Sure it works 99.999999% of the time, but what about that time when you need absolute max performance to avoid that obstacle you had no idea was there?

If you are okay with doing something that would take a one-in-a-million type situation to kill you, consider that Expressjet flies almost a million flights per year. Still like those odds?

This goes for not just the things we know could be dangerous, but all the million little things that seem completely inconsequential, like poor radio phraseology or nonstandard callouts. Everything is designed the way it is for a reason, and very often standardized rules are written with someone else's blood. Are you smart enough to know exactly which accident lead to the creation of the procedure you are dismissing, and are you absolutely sure you are not following in those same footsteps?

I guess I just know too many friends who were killed in crashes. I'm sure they all thought that they could get away with the things they were doing, too.
 

1.3XVso

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Ask capt arrogant rose how that dca p56 bust went. He's one step closer of being a astronaut. Endeveour
 

WSurf

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"A man who says, 'I am King', is no true king." ~Tywin

Game of Thrones
 

olympus593

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Okay, I'm just venting, but have you guys noticed a correlation between guys who, at some point on a trip, say "you know, this job is just not that hard," and then they prove to JUST SUCK as a pilot (especially the standardized part)? They can't accept suggestions (to avoid a major undesired state), and then make excuses for why it was all someone else's fault? I think it's a generational Millennials thing, but it boils down to, are you actually trying to be a better pilot with a little humility, or do you think you are God's gift to aviation already?

Sorry for the rant, just had to get that off my chest. I feel better now.
Guess you don t read the paper in flight?
 
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